Groups > 0...Open Debate in faith and religion...0

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Darwin wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 12:46

Jobo wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 06:24 Darwin wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 00:27 Jobo wrote on Thu, 04 December 2008 19:15 C'mon people. prove it. prove that your god is worth worshipping or that your god is powerful and omnipotent or the like. Hindi pa ba sapat na hanggang ngayon e humihinga ka pa rin sa kabila ng hindi mo pagkilala sa Dios? i am where i am now because of my will. not God's will. i survive life because i strive. not because of the will of God. i control my life. we are product of evolution. that is a fact. that is based on physical and solid evidences. where do you think we come from? Adan and Eve? coz of Bible? that's just stories. Very well said...that's the answer I've been waiting for. Now tell me, if we all believe that we can control our own lives, then why people die even though they don't want to die? Or why there are couples who want to have children but they just can't have or why there are humans born with incomplete body parts? Tell me, can we really control our life? You, why do you have to strive in life? If you control your life, then why don't have a more comfortable life? Are you filthy rich? Do you look drop-dead gorgeous with celebrity face? Are WE product of evolution??? Or maybe YOU only and Charles Darwin.

there are people who die even thought they dont want to die. but they still in the first place the ones who chose it that way. if a person died coz of a heart attack [w/o knowing when], then he is responsible for his death coz he couldve chosen a more healthy lifestyle to avoid heart problems. or if a person died coz he was hit by a truck, that person is responsible for his death coz he couldve chosen other route where he cant be hit by a truck.

i strive life because i choose to strive. i couldve just relax and do nothing but i choose to strive. its my choice.

and yes, we are product of evolution. where do you think we came from? adan and eve? stories from the bible. c'mon thats just stories. how can u believe that. it is not based on critical thinking.

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That's a simple task. Premise 1: God is omnipotent (Has the ability to do everything). Premise 2: Can God create a rock that is so heavy that he cannot carry? Since total omnipotence is impossible then a being who is omnipotent cannot exist. Conclusion: therefore God doesn't exist.

how can God create something he cannot carry? he is all powerful, he said the heavens is my throne and the earth is my footstool

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Here another example. Premise 1: God is an absolute infinite. Premise 2: According to William Lane Craig, absolute infinites cannot exist (base on his Kalam argument)so an absolute infinite being cannot exist. Conclusion: Therefore God cannot exist. John the Atheist

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so thats according to william craig how about you? nanghhiram ka nanaman ng knowledge then sasabihin mo God doenst exist.

for you what is absolute infinite?

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Darwin wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 21:46

Jobo wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 18:50 Darwin wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 12:46 Jobo wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 06:24 Darwin wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 00:27 Jobo wrote on Thu, 04 December 2008 19:15 C'mon people. prove it. prove that your god is worth worshipping or that your god is powerful and omnipotent or the like. Hindi pa ba sapat na hanggang ngayon e humihinga ka pa rin sa kabila ng hindi mo pagkilala sa Dios? i am where i am now because of my will. not God's will. i survive life because i strive. not because of the will of God. i control my life. we are product of evolution. that is a fact. that is based on physical and solid evidences. where do you think we come from? Adan and Eve? coz of Bible? that's just stories. Very well said...that's the answer I've been waiting for. Now tell me, if we all believe that we can control our own lives, then why people die even though they don't want to die? Or why there are couples who want to have children but they just can't have or why there are humans born with incomplete body parts? Tell me, can we really control our life? You, why do you have to strive in life? If you control your life, then why don't have a more comfortable life? Are you filthy rich? Do you look drop-dead gorgeous with celebrity face? Are WE product of evolution??? Or maybe YOU only and Charles Darwin. there are people who die even thought they dont want to die. but they still in the first place the ones who chose it that way. if a person died coz of a heart attack [w/o knowing when], then he is responsible for his death coz he couldve chosen a more healthy lifestyle to avoid heart problems. or if a person died coz he was hit by a truck, that person is responsible for his death coz he couldve chosen other route where he cant be hit by a truck. i strive life because i choose to strive. i couldve just relax and do nothing but i choose to strive. its my choice. and yes, we are product of evolution. where do you think we came from? adan and eve? stories from the bible. c'mon thats just stories. how can u believe that. it is not based on critical thinking. You don't get my point. Why do people die eventhough they don't want to die? Like you said, a person died of a heart attack. If we can control our lives, then even if a person is struck with a heart attack, he should live and nobody should have died of a heart attack in the first place even if they are not living a healthy lifestyle. Everybody should have died because of aging that their body cannot control the nature anymore. A person hit by a truck could have chosen the right way where he cannot hit by the truck? Then how can you know where could be that way? Why do people meet accidents? For sure, we don't want that to happen but if people can control their life everytime, then nobody should be dead because of accident or they should have not met any accidents in the first place. But why there is? Because we cannot control our life. There are ways that we thought is good but in the end, will lead us to trouble. There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. Prov. 14:12 See, God also know how you think. Then how can't I believe in God? He has answers in every thought and misthought that you have. Why do couples who want a boy instead get a baby girl or vise versa? Why do healthy couples cannot have a child? Can they control their lives? You strive in your life not because you chose to. You strive in your life because that is the kind of life that was given to you and you don't have a choice but to live with it because you do not control your life completely. There are things that we humans cannot do. Those things can be done by God without us even knowing. Like keeping us safe in everyday life. In your daily journey, you could have been hit by a stray vehicle from the opposite lane of the road. Imagine how many vehicles a day pass by you and not even one of them hit you? Have you think of that? No? Because you neglect God. By the way, the more the kind of you exist, the more I believe in God because He had already foreseen the people like you who'll not believe in Him. He called you "fool". God gave us freewill but can we do everything we want? Along with freewill He gave us rules of life and responsibility. If He did not gave us the border between the things we can and we cannot do, then there will be chaos. Killing and oppression of other people's rights will be an ordinary sight. You want that? Eventhough you don't believe in God, I think you will admit that you have conscience and feels guilty everytime you've done something wrong to somebody. You get my point boy? Where do you think it came from? From you?? Unless you don't have conscience and guilt, then no need to answer this post.

i choose this life. not god. u cant even give us evidences that he exist. god does not control my life. i do. God in that image is taking away the very essence of life, absolute freedom. find the meaning of essence in the net. if you take away that essence then it is not called life.

what we are arguing is a classic absolute existentialism vs absolute determinism. there's no such thing as "absolute" determinism [like what u are saying] because in a way we control our life [life being number 9 in John's definition]. there is also no such thing as "absolute" existentialism coz there are also other factors that influence our behavior.
for me life is a combination of both.

if god has already planned it all then praying to him would be useless. i am not asking about what you are saying. i am asking evidences that would tell us that a powerful, omnipotent, loving god exist. first show me evidence that such god exist. a god that is worth worshipping. if you said that god planned what happened and will happen then thank him for the millions of innocent people who died because of his will. if he planned that then he is not worth worshipping. what kind of god is that?!

you are saying that god sees this and that and that see knows what will happen and you cant even prove to us that he exist. you cant even show to us that a loving and powerful and omnipotent god exist. Man made God in his image and likeness. Not the other way around. primitive man invented god so that man can answer things that he cant answer [like origin of species, or rain, or thunder]. since we already know these things then God is intellectualy superfluous. also man invented god because man needs assurance of life after death. there's no lifeafter death. no ones been there. there's only this and now.

if you think that he is powerful, pray to him that the atheists and agnostics in this group will change and will all convert
to christianity. if god will grant your prayers then he exist. if not he does not exist or he just dont want to help coz he is not powerful or he's lazy.

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Bro wrote on Sat, 06 December 2008 03:39

Quote: Jobo wrote on Sat, 06 December 2008 00:02 Bro wrote on Fri, 05 December 2008 19:39 Quote: That's a simple task. Premise 1: God is omnipotent (Has the ability to do everything). Premise 2: Can God create a rock that is so heavy that he cannot carry? Since total omnipotence is impossible then a being who is omnipotent cannot exist. Conclusion: therefore God doesn't exist. how can God create something he cannot carry? he is all powerful, he said the heavens is my trone and the earth is my footstool Quote: Here another example. Premise 1: God is an absolute infinite. Premise 2: According to William Lane Craig, absolute infinites cannot exist (base on his Kalam argument)so an absolute infinite being cannot exist. Conclusion: Therefore God cannot exist. John the Atheist so thats according to william craig how about you? nanghhiram ka nanaman ng knowledge then sasabihin mo God doenst exist. for you what is absolute infinite? cge daw, prove to us that God is powerful. and loving. and that he exist. baka mga bible verses lang ipakita mo sa amin.

why not bible verses? saan ba kayo kumuha ng knowledge na walang Diyos di ba sa libro ng mga pilosopong atheist at di naniniwala sa Diyos?, paano ka nakapag aral di ba kumuha ka sa libro ng mga writer na teacher? so why not bible verses? di ba ang bible ay books na nagsasabi na may Diyos na nagbigay sa iyo ng hininga.




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sa mga libro nga pero naka base ito sa "critical thinking" and studies!!.. ang bible hindi yan naka base sa pag iisip. it is based on Faith. sa faith kasi, tinatanggap lang ang isang bagay na walang dahilan. na hindi naka base sa pagsusuri.

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how can God create something he cannot carry? he is all powerful, he said the heavens is my throne and the earth is my footstool

Then answer it Mr. Bro: Can God create a rock that is so heavy that he himself cannot carry?

A good dose of a paradox is what you need anyway.


so thats according to william craig how about you? nanghhiram ka nanaman ng knowledge then sasabihin mo God doenst exist.

for you what is absolute infinite?

You don't believe your own Christian apologist @ Bro. O baka di mo lang kilala si William Craig Lane? Sya po yung Christian philosopher na panlaban nyo sa mga atheists

So kung ako naman ang tatanungin mo, do I believe in an absolute infinite? No. kasi po gawa yan ng mga Christians. I only call infinite as "infinite", wala akong concept ng Absolute and Partial Infinites.

But I believe that infinites exists. A good example are numbers and energy.

Have a nice day @ Bro.

John the Atheist





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